Does anyone have any views, owners and those who are interested in buses, as to whether the general location of buses should be freely available on websites? For some time now there has been a debate about whether the location of particular buses should be known but only the other day I saw a bus that has been out of circulation for some time and was sworn to secrecy as to its ownership and location. I can understand given the theft of parts from old buses is not uncommon that people might like to safeguard the exact location of their buses, but is the name of the owner and the general location, town for example so in need of secrecy and in doing so is there a danger that owners removing some of the interest in our buses from the youngsters and others who are not able to afford to buy a bus for themselves?

My bus number (if any): RTL 960, RML 2667, RM 1585, RMC 1458 and 14 RTs

My own view is that there should be more information available about where fellow owners are located. I also have to accept that the actual place of storage of an individual vehicle must be kept confidential, unless the owner themselves wish to make the exact location details known. In contrast to our interest in buses, the heritage railway movement is completely open with most people being aware of the location of each locomotive for example. They also have a problem with thieves and vandalism, but at least have the advantage of interested members being able to get together more frequently to discuss issues. Our hobby unfortunately tends to be more individualistic in its outlook, with contact mainly being via a forum, or at a rally or meeting on the odd occasion throughout the year. I do not see a problem with the general location of an owner and their vehicle being freely available on a website. It is a great pity that more owners and interested individuals do not make themselves known on websites and forums. Moreover one only has to view this forum and the other one to see that relatively few individuals contribute very often, myself included in that. There is a reasonable amount of information about vehicles available on websites such as Ians Bus Stop, but how up to date it is I have no idea. The question of youngsters and their interest in buses is another very topical subject. In the heritage railway movement many are worried that if youngsters continue to show little interest, then the movement as a whole may well disappear in the not too distant future. A recent article suggested that a new member of a railway preservation society would be considered to be young if aged 40 at the time of joining. With regard to the subject yourself Brian, where do you keep all your vehicles and would you mind if interested persons made contact to see them. Looking at the forums would indicate that many contributors do not wish contact details to be known, for instance e mail addresses are not given. Judging by the poor response to your question Brian, perhaps you need look no further for an answer.

Ed

My bus number (if any): RML2335

Hi Brian and Ed ,
I personally don't mind who knows that I own RML2391 and am more than willing to talk to anyone about 2391 . However there are some who for whatever reason don't wish for their details to be made public and these should be respected . As for locations , the railway preservation sites need public access for the railway to generate income for their activities . As Ed states we more or less go our individual ways with our buses , most of us store our bus on private sites where there is no public access . Not only is this for our security but the landowners also want privacy on their land . My bus is on a farm the farmowner does not want lots of people wandering around I'm sure others are also in this position . Only recently the bus owners have been asked to make sure all gates are locked because of thefts on the farm. Only clue I would give to 2391's location is that its in Northamptonshire.
I think its a shame that more of us can't group together and find locations for museums so the public can see our road transport heritage . In the south of the country there are precious few museums for road vehicles especially when you see how many railway heritage sites there are
There is a large number of buses stored in Northamptonshire that would make the basis of a great museum collection , very few are fully restored and see the daylight , such a shame
Mark

My bus number (if any): RML2391

I have to say that I have no problem with anyone knowing which buses I own, its all on my fotopic site anyway, http://rob-duker.fotopic.net/ yes, the buses are kept on a farm in Cambridgeshire, the farmers that I rent the grain barn from, prefer to keep it a low key affair, which I understand, and agree with.

I think that Mark is right,it is a shame that more of us can't group together and find locations for museums so the public can see our road transport heritage, I am all for it.
Rob .

All our buses RMs RTs and the Bristol VR are in France Brian, at a place called Saint-Amant-Tallende which is just off Junction 5 of the A75 Autoroute near Clermont-Ferrand. Whilst we have no problem with anyone knowing where they are - all the usual people who are interested have been made fully aware of the buses we have and where they are, (Ian Smith is aware of the locations but has not updated the info yet) - like many others we don't encourage unannounced visits as its a workplace and a lot of the time nobody is there. Whilst I respect the right of privacy of bus owners, I do find the total news blackout attitude of some people a little harsh on those who just want to know that the bus exists and who owns it. But then again you get the sorts of episodes that Jack recently had to endure of theft of valuable parts that makes people keep the location of their buses top secret.

My bus number (if any): RTL 960, RML 2667, RM 1585, RMC 1458 and 14 RTs

Brian

Thats interesting, and an area we drive through every year staying overnight at places like Parentignat (Issoire) and Viaduc de Garabit on our way to Catalunya. Perhaps you might let me have your email address, then I could contact you in advance before coming to have a look at the buses and what you are doing with them, if you don't mind of course.

Ed

My bus number (if any): RML2335

It's a tricky one. I don't really like all the secrecy and rumourmongery that seems to spawn from it.
But I also respect each to their own.
There has been some recent interesting discussion on 'the other side' about just such indiscretions and their relative innocence but the potential breach of law it poses.

Some buses are kept in isolated rather vulnerable places so It is prudent to keep it quiet. After all, if you go away on holiday you don't advertise the fact to the whole street, usually it's just a neighbour to keep a watchful eye and water the plants/feed the cat etc.
With stored buses even this is not always possible and sadly as I have discovered, some bits that have vanished had been taken by 'trusted' fellow tenants. That is why I fully advocate the marking of anything removable/rare.

But with old and rare vehicles and parts, there will always be a bit of competition and rivalry when it comes to restoring and getting it right and also great camararderie. True preservationists will always swap, share and help.
There will always be the ones who hoard and profit but worst of all those who steal.

I understand that on the 'other channel some half shafts have surfaced for sale.
Now, obviously, I would love to know their origin. If only to put my mind at rest!

I wonder if anyone could help me. I came across your website trying to locate the whereabouts of RM546 (WLT546) as my grandad who worked his whole career for LT was specially selected in 1961 with some collegues from London transport to drive this particular bus across Europe on a promotional trip much the same as the GEMO trip. I would love to find the bus he drove and take him to see again as he still talks about it all time and loves showing the photo's of his trip. I did track down the number plate at stagecoach but they understandably don't sell the number plates so a trip to see the bus was my next plan. Any help or pointers gratefully received. Thanks.

A few things.

Firstly, heritage railways are also targeted by steal to order criminals. The one I am associated with recently had an entire set of batteries for a class 56 diesel locomotive stolen. They cost over £5000. Pressure and temperature gauges for heritage locomotives, steam and diesel, are no longer made and these are also a common target for thieves. Modern equivalents are available but they don’t look right and don’t fit the control panels.

Also I agree with earlier contributors that feel it is wise to be careful with information on exactly where our buses are stored.

Lastly I have recently been thinking of buying a haulage yard which is no longer being used a small family firm. There is room to store loads of buses, good maintenance facilities and easy access for the public should it be decided to start a museum. It might also be possible to apply for an operator’s licence. If anyone is seriously interested in contributing to this venture please email me off forum.

Ian's bus stop http://www.countrybus.org/RM/RM7g05.html gives a lot of information on RM546 but unfortunately doesn't say where it is now.

My bus number (if any): RM471 & RM2213

Chris,

Thanks for your help, I have tried Ians bus stop but noticed the trail goes cold after it was purchased by the company in Richmond in 1996. In case anyone can help I understand that the owner wouldn't want their details just randomly given out (especially in light of the apparent theft problem you mention) but any help will be great, I was also thinking that it would be nice to give the owner some copies of my grandad's pictures as part of the history of the bus. Cheers

Ben I have sent you a picture and an E mail, watch it does not get stuck in your spam filter. I have a feeling that this bus is in mainland Europe somewhere.

Regards

Brian

My bus number (if any): RTL 960, RML 2667, RM 1585, RMC 1458 and 14 RTs

Hi Chris,
Transport yard sounds an interesting project , perhaps if there's enough interest we could meet up and look

Cheers
Mark RML2391

My bus number (if any): RML2391

With reference tp Jack Norie's message posted above, I know the owner of the half shafts an can tell you he has been restoring a Routemaster for many years. He had a good stock of spares having bought a long time ago when Barnsley was crawling with scrap routemasters and stuff could be picked up for little more than scrap value. Thanks to him we were able to put RM1804 back on the road ten years ago when almost all of its mechanical components had been removed as part of a cannibalisation programme by previous owners MTL. He sold us a diff, radiator, gearbox, halfshafts and propshafts along with other bits and pieces for which we remain forever grateful.

Thats' great Mike, Thanks, Puts my mind at ease a bit!

Hat's off to anyone who had the foresight (and space to store components as these things always go from being in abundance to extremely rare almost overnight.
Someone on 'the other channel' predicts that a combination of the credit crunch, soaring storage costs and shortages of vital spares could see up to 50 preserved/promotional RMs get dismantled. I fear he may have well and truly hit the nail right on the head.

There are one or two in a poor state now having had nothing done to them since withdrawal, but I doubt that many of the complete ones will be scrapped. It might be tempting to break a bus and sell the spares for the amount that it could potentially fetch as parts, but not many people have the facilities to do this, so like a lot of RTs that need major work, they may get left in yards or lock ups and just deteriorate further.
If people are really strapped for cash or need expensive parts, they might sell but the problem is prices are coming down for as refurbed condition buses due to the lack of demand so the much-vaunted profits of the early days may have to be foregone. That said there is still demand for RM uses abroad if the owners don’t put restrictions on the future use of their buses they will find buyers.

My bus number (if any): RTL 960, RML 2667, RM 1585, RMC 1458 and 14 RTs

RM 1398 is currently in Switzerland near Zurich, it is leaving in the next couple of days for Spain, Madrid firstly, and will be there for a couple of months going all round the country to universities and to Fairs etc.

My bus number (if any): RM 1398