Views expressed on this website are those of the person or persons posting the message and does not reflect the views of Gogouyave.com
Rules Of this Talk Shop
Do not use this forum to post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, obscene, vulgar, hateful, abusive, threatening, or an invasion of a person's privacy, or otherwise a violation of any laws.
So please! please! try to keep your posts clean. Webmaster
I think the Preachers and Elders in the church should get serious about the way these young ladies are conducting themselves in Church and Funerals. The BIBLE says "RENDER YOUR HEART AND NOT YOUR GARMENT". That does not mean go naakeed. If this continues they would think that its ok to Streak like the people in the 70's who used to run on the streets naked in New York.
The preacher's eye is on the 'Collection Box'; and the elders are somewhat timid to say anything much to the young people these days. Besides, we're living in a world without care!
Funerals in the past used to be people dressed in black clothes. That tradition has been put aside for a more skimping outfits, that exposes the actual parts of some females, who are attending a funeral. We saw that even the deceased isn't buried in mauve and white dresses anymore. It expensive outfits,.and jewellery that some dead people are buried.
People went to funerals to share the bereavement with the surviving family members,.friends,.and relatives of the deceased loved ones. But, that was then; This is now! Definately, funerals today doesn'thave the sad feelings, as it was before, when the dead was on his/her last ride. That's been replaced beers, food, music, singing and dancing ("Happy Hour" ). With that, the young folks in a funeral sees it as appropriate to dressed for the ocassion.
While it is absolutely true, that the dead man/woman doesn't know a thing, there is still the surviving members of his/her family that should be respected, by those who are attending the funeral. Question is: does the surviving family members care about that? If they do well, then, they'll speak up for giving respects to the dead, and their loved ones.
A funeral isn't the place to show more bare skin than what's needed to be seen. Like the feet, and the hands, and the face.
I may be in the minority but aside from the ladies dressing for a “hot date” I’m ok with the nontraditional attire. When I was around 12-14 years old, I use to be scared of attending funerals, looking back, I was already scared of the dead person in the box, and I have to sit through a church with everyone dress like the dead person. The family and love ones were already sad so why add to the sadness? Last month I attended a funeral, the immediate family told all would be attendees to dress “festive” because we are celebrating the life of the deceased. The deceased siblings and close friends dressed in the traditional dark clothing, all the second and third generations’ family members wore festive tasteful attire. This tells me 10 years from now everyone will be dressing casual to funerals.
Casual dressing is one thing but skimpy dressing is quite another, and that's the point in Merle's post. It's very much like how things have changed in regards to how folks used to dress up to go to church back then. Trev, Dada wouldn't have ever thought of sending you to church looking like "some wayward boy" despite how little she had! Agreed?
Today casual dressing is more or less the norm. Come to think of it Trev, when last have you seen a woman wearing those fancy hats they used to wear long ago, well, except to attend the Kentucky Derby? Yes, times have changed. But not changed to the point where even casual dress is now inappropriate while skimpy dressing is the norm.
One more thing. Why is it that mourners expect the bereaved family to fork out those huge sums to pay for "the wining and dining?" Aren't they already burdened with the total burial costs, which in most cases are way too outlandish if you ask me? Are we still wondering why cremation is becoming so increasingly popular!!!
Trev, I agree with you about celebrating the departure (going away as we used to say) but does that mean that the families of the dead (especially men) watching womens breast and exposed lower parts of their bodies while they are grieving for the few hours? Most countries rejoice and party when someone dies in the family. They did not say come exposing your body parts. People are not obligated to wear black or purple to funerals. My next objection is the (after hour) 90% of the people are already waiting at the reception area before the dead is placed in the grave. This things are out of control. Some of the people know in advance whose funeral to attend because they know who will be having (after hours). Where I live the families of a dead person does not have to provide food. Rich or poor the members of your church or (A) church if you don't belong to one, provide food after the service. I have been there. These after hours are getting to be a monster. It's expensive to bury a loved one, is it mandatory to spend all these monies to be popular. I feel sorry for families in the future. Don't look for my family to provide after hours for me. Any one comes to my funeral, they better walk with their sweet drink (Fanta) (dey stout,carib jack iron and stew/fried chicken. Have a meal on me. LOL
Cuz, if you intend on having a cheap going away, well i need to speak with the children, you doh expect me to to put on my Sunday best dandan and u doh have Happy Hoursssssssssssssssssss. DWL, plus ah like to see, hate to imagine what they have, too much work on my degenerating ole brains. and the Bible NEVER said to "render your heart and not your garment" ONLY GRENADIANS AH EAR SAYING DAT...............THE BIBLE SAID IN Joel 2:13
"New International Version
Rend your heart and not your garments. Return to the LORD your God, for he is gracious and compassionate, slow to anger and abounding in love, and he relents from sending calamity.
New Living Translation
Don't tear your clothing in your grief, but tear your hearts instead." Return to the LORD your God, for he is merciful and compassionate, slow to get angry and filled with unfailing love. He is eager to relent and not punish.
English Standard Version
and rend your hearts and not your garments.” Return to the LORD your God, for he is gracious and merciful, slow to anger, and abounding in steadfast love; and he relents over disaster.
New American Standard Bible
And rend your heart and not your garments." Now return to the LORD your God, For He is gracious and compassionate, Slow to anger, abounding in lovingkindness And relenting of evil.
King James Bible
And rend your heart, and not your garments, and turn unto the LORD your God: for he is gracious and merciful, slow to anger, and of great kindness, and repenteth him of the evil.
Holman Christian Standard Bible
Tear your hearts, not just your clothes, and return to the LORD your God. For He is gracious and compassionate, slow to anger, rich in faithful love, and He relents from sending disaster.
International Standard Version
Tear your hearts, not your garments; and turn back to the LORD your God. For he is gracious and compassionate, slow to become angry, overflowing in gracious love, and grieves about this evil.
Cuz, I like the Holman and the International version. Cuz you have a special invitation to my funeral, but bring your own drink. LOL
And here is the Gouyave version dat Sister Merle is vehemently objecting to :
"Render your garment to thy eyes oh merciful children of Gouyave, so I can see your beating heart and feel the beating pulse of thy body.
Stay close to your inebriated Brothers piercing eyes and expose thy self in rememberance of the dust! that surely would follow you too in your final days.
Be attuned to his every words as he demonstrates his intent to rescue your flesh from the demons of death's decaying mischievousness; bow to him in the present of others to indicate your intention of seeking mercy for your sins, through the pennance of copulation after the repass.
Demonstrate your intention to show no limits to the social barriers that kept you in a life of bondage; yearning to be freed before that inevitable return to the dust and ashes that awaits all of us".
Gouyaveman, on loss prevention. ........LOL
Brother V, I thought that you were invited to my funeral, but ah change me mind, unless you bring your own bottle. LOL. Just a good laugh. My Cuz is invited, he likes chicken an manicou. He will have to catch them in clozier.
"....... I thought that you were invited to my funeral, but ah change me mind, unless you bring your own bottle. LOL. "
This may be the solution you are looking for " funeral attendance by iinvitation only".
It would surely curb the fleshy appetite of those men as only gentlemen would be invited and the ladies would follow suit in their attire, curbing their lusting eyes even forther.
I can see Tony and Observer wearing their dark shades to prevent the glare of the sun in their eyes.
Lord help you yes! LOL
Trev, it is better to celebrate the life of a living person. The dead will forever care less what was done with his/her body. They don't even know who's attending their funerals. It useless, whether the dead person was rich or poor, to spend lots of money for a coffin, clothes, "Happy Hour", and to the funeral parlors. The money will always be better spent on the deceased, but while he/she was alive. Most folks don't give much to their loved ones while they're alive. However, a lump sum is paid to the funeral parlors, just to keep the dead person above earth for days, or weeks, before they are laid to rest. Some people even ended up owing the funeral parlors, and have to struggle to make payment, by monthly installments, for crediting a coffin among other things from the funeral parlors. How about helping out the poor and needy instead of giving more money to the funeral parlors, who are so often deemed rich?
The LaQua family in Grenada came to my mind. They dominated the burying of the dead, while others like Mr. Forsyth, in Victoria, St. Mark's, and our very own, Mr. Bill, in Gouyave faded away quietly, from the pack.
I know that people often see things their way, and nothing's wrong with that. Still, though, when someone is dead, I cannot see the celebrating of it. It was now between the Maker of All Mankind, and the dead person themself. We've yet to understand that nothing we do or say can cause God, nor the deceased person to change their minds. However, I see a party held after a person is dead means zero for that person,.while on the road to the 'Great Beyond'.
Let's not forget that life is living, and so is death.
My take only!
you made some good points brother Daniel.
Remember however that
The Funeral etc is a cultural thing and there are variations in the practice.
In some areas of Africa it is even a bigger thing and that has been their tradition for centuries.
It is a final " farewell" and although some people take advantage of it ( what's new?), it can be somewhat therapeutic for the family- i.e, meeting friends, lost friends, families, interacting, ' boy long time since I saw you' etc and engaging in a memory lane conversation can be therapeutic.
Of course, like anything else in life, it can be abused.
It is for the living and when people get together you smell food.
Do you remember when people used to say that someone was buried like a pauper? And they used to cry shame- eh he.
I completely agreed with Daniel's take on things. I always say to my family show me love while I am alive not when I have left this world as I am unable to feel and appreciate it. For me those left behind can buy the cheapest coffin, why waste money on expensive caskets? I'm dead I can't enjoy or like it.
On the other hand I am not against family gathering after a funeral as someone else said to talk and ease the grieving. It's just the group of people who use funerals as free and enjoyable day out.
My Mother is always telling me and my siblings 'No happy hour for me' lol. As my Father would say ' We is not them type a people, people come from far you must give them a drink and sandwich' lol.
to some extent, the events of the family are for the living not the dead.
We can choose to eat in Calabash for example- does it make a difference; what matters is the nutrient from the food. So let's replace our china etc and fancy plates with calabashes.
I do not consider myself "old" but thank God, I have been on the planet earth for a couple of decades and it is cultural common practice to treat your guest with something to eat or drink for example.
Now if the "quest" keep on coming by some strange coincidence around time for breakfast, lunch and dinner that's going to " raise a red flag".
But then again, there are some people who are truly dependent or needy from that standpoint.
On the otherhand, there will be people who are there just for the food just based on greed and as my grandparents would have said " they are too glutenous".
Here is a solution:
when we give out the program in the church we should also give a coupon for the happy hour.
But be prepared, as words spread, we will need bigger churches as more people may come to the church with the sole purpose of getting the coupon for the food.
I hear some of them bawl so much as if they knew or is related to the deceased. More bawl more food!They are some actors.
They should be in Hollywood.
I heard that in Grenada churches are springing up all over the place where people are joining with the intention of getting hand outs from the big brother/sister sponsors in the USA. Go figure. LOL.
lol lol Giving a coupon! That really made me laugh, but at least it's an idea.
I have heard of a few families doing invitation only funeral receptions. What my family have done when having funerals in Grenada is to have snacks and some food also a couple of bottles of alcohol with plenty homemade juice, when it's done that's it.
I do feel there is no point in putting yourself in debt to look good in the eyes of others.
To the people to are under dressing take a long look in the mirror and ask yourself is this outfit suitable?
To the greedy people stop and think should you really be treating a funeral as an all you can eat restaurant.
Merle, you started a very interesting thread! Some of the responses were thought provoking while others were very funny. And our new pastor from the "new-age" church chose to preach! lolol
Some of the outfits I see are indeed a bit non-conforming to the usually acceptable funeral outfit, but times have changed, after all. In days "gone by" even back in my youth, as little skin as possible used to be shown for ANY occasion - then came the mini skirts, then even the tank tops etc. for any event, and much appreciated. lol Of course, one can put a light jacket or even what is called a "shell" over a tank top or strappy dress and make it less revealing and still suitable for the occasion but some do not take that extra step.
We must remember not to be too harsh though. Render your hearts and not your garments can go both ways. What if people have only what is sent from abroad by relatives who give no thought to proper funeral attire as a "send down." Then people just wear what they have! Would we rather people stay home and not come to pay respect or support the bereaved - to me there is nothing as sad as an empty church when someone dies.
I have a feeling that there are not too many dressmakers around anymore - we had Mrs. St. John, Ms. Leslyn, Ms. Vernice, Mrs. Walma, Tr. Nouna, among others and I do not know if they have been replaced. Our Grenadian ladies may now have to rely on what is brought in for sale or sent down to them. Quite frankly, I don't think much of fashion designers nowadays as we are simply left to their mercies.
Someone suggested that the priests are turning a blind eye - but how can he, whoever he may be, discriminate against people who are not modestly dressed. Does he then police the door with a measuring tape for skirt hems and give each lady the look see to check on if their bosoms are covered? More trouble now. And what if the bereaved are scantily dressed? lol
There is the matter of perception. One might think that they look great in an outfit even if to another it is just "not on" either as a fit or for the occasion. Also, in a place that does not have much by way of social events for dressing up, when people do go out even if is to a funeral they want to look good and if they feel they look good (whether they do or not from another's perspective) they feel good about themselves. Let us not deny people that feeling.
Maybe your post will be an eye opener for the future. To help things out I now call on my dear friend Don to start a special funeral service line of clothing in her store - both modest and modern. :-)
Sister AM, I read and understand your opinion. Did you read my dear CUZ version of the heart and the garment? LOL. Girl, these people know about dressing. You will be surprised to know that Grenada has a lot of functions where gouyave people dress up. Its not like the days when we had to wait for a holiday or harvest to wear our Dan Dan to go to the dance or ALLDAY in the park. There are little stores like Dawn and others where they can buy clothes from overseas. I don't think that seamstress and Tailor exist no more. I may be wrong. If so, they may be used for adjustments. Many of these young ladies are dressing and hoping that Arthur comes by with the camera so they can be Gouyave models. LOL.. I also read about the food situation. If the families can afford to feed every one on behalf of the dead so be it. My only objection is not everyone can afford to feed people after the funeral. I, personally listen to people talking in gouyave. I spent 21 days. I attended three funerals. Before the funeral took place everyone knew who was having (after hours). Some people may not like my opinion. It's freedom of speech. Every does not like Obama, but he is the PRESIDENT. Girl, you know I love to get in trouble. Don't be hard on me. LOL.
Have you been listening to Grenada news ( GBN, etc) recently? Some tough economic restructuring.
Finally reality is beginning to trickle in- it's about time.
" clothes from overseas".
Probably few if any seamstresses in Grenada.
And we say the employment rate is high there.
So much for self sufficiency- oops, did I say that?
Australia priority is Asia; Europe priority is now Eastern Europe/ Ukraine.
So Merlo, how many of the three happy hours did you attend? lol
But seriously, it is only recently I hear that this happy hour is creating a "problem." I myself hate the term happy hour. Here it is when people get discounted services or goods so maybe people should pay and this is where the suggested coupon would come in handy? teehee In New York it is called a repast but one does not have to attend all repasts and surely you do not have to eat or drink or have too much of anything. People sometimes get offended if you say you do not have time to stay or to eat. I see it as a way to see members of the bereaved family that you may not have seen in ages but for the most part I myself usually have to run off to do something or other anyway .
From a conversation I had with someone who had just buried her mother, I gathered that the more one can deliver at the happy hour the more of a status symbol one can become so I guess it goes both ways?? lol One person I know told me that she was unable to attend a certain funeral as she had been working all day and got home much too late. I told her to go and sympathize but she said that would have to wait for another day because she did not want people to say she had come for happy hour.
Merle, I appreciate your concern, but this is not limited to Gouyave but everywhere. Certainly in NYC. Thing is the Gen X generation is driven by style and fashion, and those young ladies you are castigating might simply be wearing the only little black dress they have, which is fashionable, dress up garb, or they may be wearing their Sunday Best, which is what they go to church in every Sunday.
Either way is a funeral the place or time to be checking out the apparel of the fellow mourners?
Do we prefer that those young sexy things come as they like, or don't come at all? Any thought about what the deceased would prefer, IF ONLY THEY COULD.