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Migration and its Legacies.

Mya, I am in total agreement with you concerning the importance of the topic. Unfortunately, it deteriorated far off into triviality because of my curiosity to know the man behind "Downstreet." Other than getting to know this brilliant blogger up-close and personal, there was no other further interest. So as far as I'm concerned that's past tense.

Perhaps now we can veer off and bury the last topic as it really was so too narrow, focusing only on the loss of friends and family through migration. That's why it was titled "A legacy of Migration." But as we know there is so much more than just that legacy, hence the more appropriate thread/title "Migration and its Legacies." Hopefully it will encourage discussions that will cover not only the loss of families and friends but among others, topics like living and settling in those lands that we choose to call home.

Hey Downstreet, now that we know who the new president on January 20th is, I hope things would not be as frightening despite the crazy rhetoric of the campaigning. I hope things will follow the usual pattern where the enormity of the office will sober President-elect Trump, and make him drop all the nonsense that he previously spew. His first meeting yesterday with President Obama seems to be an indication of that. I trust that is the beginning of his turning around, so that Gouyavearians would not be pushed out.
Otherwise "cur-cut eat our name." Should that be so I beg of you at home to drop the epithet JCBs as they are likely to see many more from the USA visiting Grenada far more frequently than before.

I've already planned to be home next year anyway.

Re: Migration and its Legacies.

Tony I am not holding my breath. It is obvious that, the gasbag Chump, is as phony as a three dollar bill, and is the human embodiment of the "porcupine" fish, we used to catch by the "Old stall" prickly on the outside, gaseous on the inside, and stinking to boot.
There is no way that a sixty year old racist, misogynist, can find within him ANY, redeeming values. Unless the people of the country force him out, America, will sink to depths, hitherto unknown. This guy honestly believes that he is KING of the world, and will go out of his way to prove it to everybody.All I could say is, he better doh mash, Downstreet, we bad as yaws.
The American racists are trying to obliterate the existence of Barak Obama, from the Country's history books,and like the succeeding Pharaohs of Egypt, who upon taking power, defaced and erased every relic of their predecessor that they could find, so to they are hoping that "The Chump" can whitewash Obama"s legacy.But what those yokels do not understand is that historians will always fill in the holes, and go to great lengths to explain what has been painted over. The triumph of this election, is that it confirms, that there are twice as many racists in America, than was previously accepted. We treat JCB's with honor, when they visit, those that we cannot stand are the NCB's......Not the Bank, The NEVER COME BACK.

Re: Migration and its Legacies.

“I am guilty of war when I think that a land of a man's birth must necessarily be the place of his livelihood.” This statement was one of many Creeds I first saw on a plaque hanging behind Frank Dabreo’s shop door, and it had a deep impact on me. I later realized it to be the Rosicrucian Creed and was later able to understand many things about the “who is who” around Gouyave and their knowledge. I use this particular statement as I think it apropos in this context of migration and its legacies.

What was the driving force of people migrating to England in the early days pre- Gairy and during the early years of his rule? I venture to say it was opportunity to make a better living as nursing opportunities opened up in England. Many just left with no family abroad and hoped for the best as they say. They landed in a strange foreign land and worked hard as nurses’ aides progressing to a full career reaching maybe MD level in some cases others gained Midwifery level while other pursued law and other professional fields. Some of these migrants crossed to the US and furthered their careers and to this day still live in the US with no thoughts of returning home while others, fewer in number, are beginning to move back to the homeland primarily to the southern part of the island. I have noticed that much more people from the UK experience are the ones that are moving back to the Island with the propensity to settle in their original parish and even original home which they renovated. What is behind this dynamic? People from the UK are more prone to return home while those from the US are less likely to return.

The hardships endured in the early days, one would assume, should have changed them immensely but that generation seems to have been very family oriented and thus they endured to return and build homes and purchase lands. So again why does the US experience differ so much?

How many of the people returning home have actually put they experience and training to work in an advisory or consultation capacity lending to a progressive homeland? Has the government developed a strategy to harness that brain power that is returning to the Motherland? Could there be any virtue in a strategy to let people migrate, gain economic power, education, and then complete the cycle by returning home and investing in the progress of the homeland?

Re: Migration and its Legacies.

>>How many of the people returning home have actually put they experience and training to work in an advisory or consultation capacity lending to a progressive homeland? Has the government developed a strategy to harness that brain power that is returning to the Motherland? Could there be any virtue in a strategy to let people migrate, gain economic power, education, and then complete the cycle by returning home and investing in the progress of the homeland?<<

Thanks Maya, for opening up a subject that so many of us old-timers have discussed many, many times. Talking about LEGACIES, here is one real positive legacy of migration that is literally going wasted and untapped. Boy, I've heard many highly qualified retired professionals saying how they wished that there was some way in which the Grenada government could devise a plan to utilize their skills. Some have even broached the subject with the Tillman as well as the Mitchell's administration, but all came up for naught.

Maybe when these guys get in power they are suddenly confronted with a reality, and therefore weird logic that's far from obvious to the general public who must be kept in the dark. How else can one explain the many refusals by government to accept even FREE gifts? Redundancy, I suppose, but I can't think of any other way to express it.

One of my old GBSS schoolmates who is a touted cardiologist here in America said that as a retiree he has offered his services virtually free of charge except some basics to the government. In fact he included a list of other professionals who are also willing to offer their services under the same conditions to the government. It turned out to be a waste of time, money and energy.

This Forum has been inundated with people who have posted their stories about government's refusal to accept what is virtually free equipment to them. Even we in Gouyave begged both governments to take over the maintenance of the toilets in the cemetery that were built without even a penny contribution from any of the administrations. Again, all for naught.

So I'll continue to ask, what is there in the Grenada governments that is refusing the genuine offers that its sons and daughters are willing and able to provide sometimes at little or no cost to the treasury?

I hope it's not because we are regarded and dismissed as JCBs.

Re: Migration and its Legacies.

Downstreet, your opinions of Trump are very similar to mine. But just as good men sometimes do turn bad, I am hoping the reverse may be true too. That's why I'm hoping that the awesomeness and the enormity of the office might just inject some sobering thoughts and attitudes in the Chump. What a time!!

Re: Migration and its Legacies.

The worry going forward with the Trump administration is not Trump, in my opinion ,but it is the people he is surrounding himself with and the dark agenda they will try to push forward. Trump likes to win and succeed even if it is just a semblance of same but the experience and cunning in the political arena of the cohorts he has lined up for executive positions in similar to the Dick Cheney and George Bush Administration. No meaning to go off the Migration thing just a sidebar I hope

Re: Migration and its Legacies.

Tony, take out the u and put i between the h and the m: chimp - not chump lol! BTW, all those hoping for better now, good luck, allu ever c leopard change skin?

Re: Migration and its Legacies.

On migration/emigration or immigration, would the Saga of that Legacy continue despite our building of any utopian society?

Let us have a look!

First, I will preface my opinion with a preamble, that every individual is driven by a predisposition of a genetic indulgence to find avenues of opportunities for him/her self in order to improve their lot in life. To the extent that we recognize that our "needs/wants" are conditional requirements of temporary inconveniences, so too we must conclude that the barriers to obtaining them are also temporary disturbances.The innate nature of man to use his God-given ambitions and talents would eventually supercede these obstacles. And when one recognizes that
the country of his birth cannot provide the avenues by which his ambition can be satisfied, he/she would eventually leave to find them elsewhere, hence the legacy will continue.

This, in my opinion, is where the evolution of the emigrant began. It is within that context that the word "Exodus" ("A going out; a departure or emigration, usually of a large number of people:") seems more appropriate than any other, despite the contrary opinion of our Tony De's  good Doctor friend. To infer otherwise.... as with the word "over flow" by the good Doctor, is to conjure up a connotation of a spill over of some sort, precipitated by over-population and this was hardly the case with our West Indian/Grenadian experience.

The History of this migratory and emigratory behavior among all species of the world dates back since time immemorial. It is captured yearly, notably among the Wildebeests on the plains of the Sarengeti in Africa. Also notable is the annual journey of the Hump Back Whales from South America to as far North as Alaska.They too are following that same genetically prescribed behavior in order to satisfy that  propensity for survival.

These migratory spcies can be a parallel case study of human migration as it is innate among all the species of the world with no exemptions given to us hemo sapiens. We follow the links on the food chain as a means of survival and it is only within that context that the perceived scourge of immigration on economically distressed societies can be fully addressed snd understood.

Here is the making of a Doctoral Dissertation that some of you younger folks can pursue.

But embedded within the immigration legacy is the often discussed issue of the inequitable trade-off of human resources between the host country and the country of one's birth.

There is a school of thought that believes this shifting of people impeeds the development of economically challenged countries due to the exportation of the young minds necessary for its nation building initiatives. This implication, commomly referred to as "brain drain" is one that is shared and argued chiefly among our Caribbean nationalists as a means of circumventing some of their failed efforts to properly chart avenues of economic upliftment for our people.

Another school of thought argues that developing countries, in most cases, do not have the economic resources necessary to develop their own young minds. As such, they must depend on imported professional educators, to complement the residual benefits from their foreign trained returning nationals. Therefore, it is important to recognize that  the 'brain drain' connotation is only applicable, to the extent that it is "carried" by the immigrant but without the 'draining effect' of any professional loss that the argument purports.

It is probably within these acceptable notion that the "free passage without hindrance" (full credit given to our once talkshop, Lady Genevieve) is being adopted among the countries of Western Europe to appease the refugee status of their Eastern Brothers and Sisters. But this phenomenon should not be confused with the emigration driven individuals. In this case, the 'brain drain' implication may be applicable.

But while there may be some truths within all arguments, it is without any doubt, that in the long run, the immigration trade-off in most cases (both educationally and economically) favors the host country in the long run. Just think about ourselves; what we came with vis a vis, what we contributed and what we left behind.

The difference is astronomical.

I will indulge here with yet another hyperbolic reference to accommodate those who may have envisioned the development of a utopian society to impeed the efforts of emigration and explain it away:

So moving forward from here and after another three decades, the year is now 2046. We have built a perfect society. Our cultural an social re-training initives implemented earlier have borne fruits; we have been successful in re-ingineering our society and have now charged government with its implementation. The populace are all smiling again with newly developed whitened, polished teeth; the young men are back cultivating the land with GPS controlled Plows and Combines Harvesters; the young ladies attire of Maxi Skirts being worn below their knees as mandated by law is now common place and on Sundays, the church piews of all denominations are fill to capacity with the mass and homily now being conducted in Mandarin. We have banned what was the once considered vulgarity of carnival and have adopted the religious edict that forbades the consumption of alcohol and use of contraceptives.

In one of our government pronouncements, it was reported that the country's debt has now ballooned to over six Billion Dollars and asked that everyone tighten their belts with austetity programs to follow.....sounds familiar.? We had sent "our negotiating team" to Beijing to negotiate our debt, the result of which was an extended forgiveness being tacked on the back end. We have placed on notice, the closing of all twenty five of our embassies throughout the world, leaving open, only the ones in China, India, US and Canada.

But there is good news that should make all of us proud.

Our young men and women who had left us a decade ago to further their studies have all graduated. We have over fifteen Scientists graduating with their Phd's from Tsinghua University and another five from Nanjing in China. From the University of New Delhi we have eighteen Medical Doctors. From Havard Business School we have over twenty graduates and from London School of Economics, twenty six. They are all due to return home to aid in our nation building initiatives. And most importantly, Miss Odan, Mi-mi and El Mira Fudge and Sugar-Cake are now being wrapped and exported.

With all these accomplishments, can we now say that the saga of immigration and its legacy would cease?

It is my humble opinion that as long as it is perceived that " the grass is greener in other pastures" the saga will continue to chart the epic journey of the immigrant.

VJL